Here's a quick list of items everyone should do before they submit a board for review. Following these simple steps should help increase the odds of quickly passing through the review on the first try. This list is a supplement to the Mapmaking Minimums Guidelines (MMG), and consists mostly of items too specific to be considered for inclusion in that list, but which are consistently overlooked.

1. Play at least 1 complete DEV game on the map.

If you do this, the rest of this guide shouldn't even need to be said. There is a long list of people who have volunteered their time to test maps to make sure that all the MMG items are met, as well as the rest of this list. Submitting the map for official review should be your LAST step, and you should be confident your map will pass before you even consider pressing the button. Hearing from someone else that they think your map will pass the review ought to be an unofficial prerequisite for such confidence.

2. Actually,  that's it.

If you do #1, anything else I have to add here should be covered. Clear borders, fully functional fills, clear continents and bonus values, all the rest ought to fall right into place. If not, don't click the Submit for Review button.

We have got to get to work on the Board Design section of help. Something is obviously going very wrong. Every board that I've seen come through for review (aside from legacy boards from existing designers) has had serious, serious flaws. People don't even understand the very basic elements of board design.

See: http://www.wargear.net/games/join/5304

This demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of what the basic idea is. (and, by the by, I think we were right to eliminate circle mode for this same reason).

1. The Circle Mode distinction needs to be pointed up, I think. It occurs to me that the problem with maps like The World and this Mars when they get to REV stage is they're using circle mode, which is disallowed for that type of game, so the territories end up just not working.

2. The help needs to be much more basic. There needs to be more material like the OP here, what we're working on in the "Review Guidelines" thread, and Reich's Mapmaking Tutorial thread, rather than a quick overview of design options that's currently there.

3. Whatever we end up with in the Help area, it needs to be MUCH MORE OBVIOUS than it is. I imagine people are just going into the board designer and having at it, with no idea what they're doing, never thinking to consult help. I suggest having a default screen in the board designer (easily coded, I'd guess, if there are no boards to list, display this screen) with a link to the Help, links to the relevant Forum posts, etc. So people look at this stuff BEFORE they start, rather than after they submit a map for REV and we start getting frustrated. Additionally you could make some of these links available from the board designer screen at all times. Again, I don't think it's obvious where to find info on this right now.

I've got 3 maps I'm quite excited about in progress, but I guess I'll move my mapmaking tutorial up my priorities list. *sniff*

asm wrote: We have got to get to work on the Board Design section of help. 

I agree.  I've been trying to think of ways to update it, without going into dozens of pages of examples or nitpicky details that just overwhelm a new designer.  That's why I pretty much haven't touched them much.  I think tom did a great job the overall summary and hitting the high points of board design, but that may be because I've worked with board designing stuff.  

Also I'm kind of unsure what all should be there, should you really have a Help for making an image?  That seems kind of self explanatory, get a good image and make it.  Or a How To Use Paint.net?  I dunno, maybe so (just feels a bit out of place on a Risk site).  I would like to make an Initial Setup Help page, since all that can be quite confusing, and I do look forward to Cram's turtorial.

I like the idea too really point towards it and the forums prior to map making, because I think you're right asm in that "people are just going into the board designer and having at it", which is both good and bad (and really bad at the Reviewers time).

Does a Board need to be Pre-Reviewed prior to being allowed to start a Review game by the Review Crew?  It's one more step, but could save time if there was just a couple of people that said, Yes play it out, or No start again/play some test games.

Re the last point, there should be an easy and convenient way for reviewers to abort games. Say if 2 reviewers in a REV game thumbs-down the map, the game is automatically terminated. This could even occur before the game starts. This would save time and explanation.

THIS WORKS WELL WITH MY VERSIONING IDEA. I'll post more in that thread.

I think the Mars Map points out the very bad idea-ness of eliminating circle mode. I thought it smacked of elitism when it was proposed, I still think it sucks now. A completely obvious case of a small group of people imposing a design philosophy opposed to what the general public actually wants.

Feel free to disagree, but you are wrong.

Go ahead and make a circle map if you want to.....no issues here from me as long as you draw the circles on the map and use fill mode on them.

"I lost my faith with my taste for sausages and hate, no, you can't come in for tea and biscuits"
-Carter The Unstoppable Sex Machine

IRoll11s wrote: I think the Mars Map points out the very bad idea-ness of eliminating circle mode. I thought it smacked of elitism when it was proposed, I still think it sucks now. A completely obvious case of a small group of people imposing a design philosophy opposed to what the general public actually wants.

Feel free to disagree, but you are wrong.

Mars map can easily be a Fill Mode though and would/will look better and easier to see borders.  The map designer can make it circle and start games on his own still.

Exactly! The Mars Map actually does the opposite of what you say, 11's. It confirms that the majority of people don't know what they are doing, and that people who don't know what they are doing should learn before they bother me with anything. If you want to call that elitism, well, fine. ;)

All joking aside, come on. Like Risky said, if you really love to look at little circles with lines between them, draw your map that way. But I'll be darned if anybody who goes to the trouble of drawing their map that way is going to leave it that way unless there's a reason. Which in the vast majority of the cases under discussion, there isn't! Teach a man to fish, brother!

OK, so you're right and I'm wrong, but you're still wrong.

You're right because yes, with circle mode it's way to easy to pick any old random image, slap on some squiggles, add some borders and circles and throw the whole stinking pile of crap up for review.

You're wrong because circle mode is the defacto standard by which these games are recognized. I would be willing to bet my left testicle that 95% of the playing population if shown a random map would be not even notice if it was fill mode or circle mode. It's like the equivalent of putting a 2nd coat of white paint on the ceiling.. if you're a do-it-yourselfer you do it, if you're a professional contractor you don't. Why not? Because nobody fucking looks at the ceiling when they walk into a room.

However, I guess I will bow to the your rightness over my rightness, because I guess at heart I'm an elitist too, and I do put a 2nd coat on the ceiling.

Lol I like the random 95% stat there 11s.

I have the research to back it up =]

Shouldn't somebody be coding a "My Turn" plug-in instead of researching the map preferences of the Online Risk population?

Note: You forgot to round up....it's 95.6% so actually 96%

'You're wrong because circle mode is the defacto standard by which these games are recognized.'

Don't care

'I would be willing to bet my left testicle that 95% of the playing population if shown a random map would be not even notice if it was fill mode or circle mode.'

Don't care

'It's like the equivalent of putting a 2nd coat of white paint on the ceiling...'

It's totally not like that at all. It's like carrying a bucket of white paint into a room and splashing most of it in the direction of the ceiling versus actually painting the ceiling properly.

'However, I guess I will bow to the your rightness over my rightness, because I guess at heart I'm an elitist too'

Think of it this way: We're actually helping the less fortunate because we teach them to improve their own destinies.

using fill mode = breeding the Ubermensch

asm wrote:

'It's like the equivalent of putting a 2nd coat of white paint on the ceiling...'

It's totally not like that at all. It's like carrying a bucket of white paint into a room and splashing most of it in the direction of the ceiling versus actually painting the ceiling properly.

You are missing the target of the analogy.  The "It's" refers to requiring fill mode, whereas using circle mode would by default be using a single coat.  You are maintaining that using circle mode is splashing some paint around the room, that's fine, but you got the analogy backwards.

And Risky, what I NEED to be doing is putting the stupid X-mas lights up before it's February. =/

Whoops, Magpie I think you just Godwin'd this thread in a round-about manner... =]

Cramchakle wrote: I've got 3 maps I'm quite excited about in progress, but I guess I'll move my mapmaking tutorial up my priorities list. *sniff*

I'm hoping one of them is Fallout...

In that case 11's I don't get it. So I win.

Haha, I was actually thinking about Neitzsche when I posted that, but that works too =P