tom had mentioned that in progress tourneys will be affected along with new tourneys.  This makes sense since the winner of the in-progress tournaments has not yet been determined.

I'm updating the tournament view - tournament score will be dropped and H2H / SOS / SODOS / SOSOS added in it's place.

This has now been implemented - see http://www.wargear.net/forum/showthread/904/New_Features_Changes_and_Bug_Fixes#last

Well done, tom!  The implementation looks great and the feedback from the community seems positive.  Thanks to everyone who participated in the discussion to help refine the tiebreaker system.  And thanks, tom, for undertaking the work to put this in place.

I'm glad to see that "true ties" (as defined by this system) are quite rare.  That no one gets a trophy in that rare case is just fine.  I would have been okay with either no one gets the trophy or they each get a trophy.

I think both should get a trophy in cases of a true tie.  They will be so rare that I don't think this will be a problem.

Mad Bomber: Yes

So I read the entirety of this whole argument, but I know that I blacked out somewhere in the middle, and am not sure I caught all the nuances.

So can someone answer me this:
Is SODOS calculated only at the time of a given match, or is it continually recalculated as the tournament progresses?
So when Player A beats Player B in the first round, he automatically has an SODOS calculation that is posted.
Assume that Player B then ends up winning all future games in the tournament.
Does Player A's SODOS only include B's DOS from the end of Game 1 (zero) or from the end of the entire tournament (some larger number)?

Translation: Does timing between rounds now matter?

BorisTheFrugal wrote:

Translation: Does timing between rounds now matter?

No, the sum of opponents' score is just the sum of their wins, regardless of when or which rounds they took place in. Same for the sum of defeated opponents' score. By contrast, the previous system was sensitive to the rounds (but not the finish time!) in which the wins took place.

I don't know how it updates, but it seemed from a recent tournament that the tiebreakers are updated with each new piece of information (as each game finishes). So, what you know of the tiebreak stats is time sensitive (true, of course, of any tiebreak system).

All the figures are continuously recalculated as each game is completed. So timing doesn't matter.

A word of caution:

Putting too much emphasis on the tiebreaker figures before the all the tournament rounds are completed can paint a false image of who is leading, simply because not all of the information is yet available to build the tiebreaker numbers.

Conan wrote:

A word of caution:

Putting too much emphasis on the tiebreaker figures before the all the tourna...something about counting your chickens before they hatch.

Whatever...I'M WINNING!

That is hilarious Beastlymaster.  Thanks for the laugh.

BM: Only because we are on the same team...

Still WINNING!

Beastlymaster wrote:I think both should get a trophy in cases of a true tie. They will be so rare that I don't think this will be a problem.

I guess this would be the thread for what seems to be an ongoing issue with current tourneys and that is ties, true ties and tourney wins/trophies. When I look at the input and logic that folks shared in this thread to hammer this out I can't help but think what is happening is a bit flawed.

All of us playing in the tourneys have seen the dreaded 3 way ties over and over again in tourneys and mysteriously the trophy/win gets awarded to one individual or team and we just can't seem to figure out the criteria for how it's awarded. In the above example (apologies to weathertop, not his fault) weathertop walked away with the trophy and listed as winner. Now, that doesn't seem to be legit by any measure.

ref link: https://www.wargear.net/tournaments/view/3451

In this example "You don't mess with" got the trophy and presumably credit for a tournament win.

ref link: https://www.wargear.net/tournaments/view/3279

I don't think the folks who gave such insightful suggestions in the beginning would settle for what currently appears to be whichever team/individual is listed last as Tied in the "Status" column is the sole recipient of the win/trophy. I know you might scoff at this, but look at your tied tourneys and prove me wrong cuz that 6 way tie (not a true tie) got folks asking some questions about tiebreakers.

Either all true ties should get the win/trophy or no one? It would seem to me that a little bit of "if/then/and/or" tweaking could fix this rather easily.

Thoughts?

that's... weird indeed :-)

Luckily, I'm rarely in such a position (a benefit of not being a great player :-D )

Anyway.... if you end up with a 'true tie' scenario, another interesting(?) way to deal with it (and may have been mentioned earlier, I haven't dived through the thread) would be to put all the true-tie players into a single sudden death multiplayer game of the board (if possible).

agwyvern wrote:that's... weird indeed :-)

Luckily, I'm rarely in such a position (a benefit of not being a great player :-D )

Anyway.... if you end up with a 'true tie' scenario, another interesting(?) way to deal with it (and may have been mentioned earlier, I haven't dived through the thread) would be to put all the true-tie players into a single sudden death multiplayer game of the board (if possible).

That's not a solution in hootz' top example. The board Seven is purely 1-on-1. Having a six player tiebreaker game on it would require the board creator to do some really heavy thinking first.

It does look like the old method, "score", is still active, just not visible, and acts as the tiebreaker in these kinds of tourneys.

OR ..

Everybody wins. Everybody gets a trophy on their mantle and fractional tournament wins are recorded.

..I'm pretty sure this was proposed and voted down. Nobody likes to share.

Litotes wrote:agwyvern wrote:

It does look like the old method, "score", is still active, just not visible, and acts as the tiebreaker in these kinds of tourneys.

So that's how I ended up with the trophy? As mentioned in the tourney messages, i didn't think 4-6 should be in the running; but wasn't going to complain too hard.